back to article Fujitsu wants NHS exit payment

Fujitsu Services has submitted a claim for payment to the NHS, following its sacking in May from the National Programme for IT. A spokesperson for the firm refused to confirm or deny a claim in the Independent that the vendor is asking for £700m of the £896m it was due to have been paid if the ten year contract had been …

COMMENTS

This topic is closed for new posts.
Silver badge

Under the terms of a joint confidentiality agreement with Fujitsu ...

... we're able to flush your hard-earned taxes down the crapper and no-one will ever be held accountable, yippee!

"Commercial in confidence" is fine for two businesses who wish to protect the terms from inspection by competitors (either of the buyer or seller). But gummint is not in competition with anyone, and I have a right to know how well (or badly) MY money is spent. Once the deal has been struck, the terms should be published for all to see, and potential vendors who don't want to see this happen don't have to bid (none of them would withdraw from this kind of gravy train, of course). It's the only way to prevent this kind of balls-up.

0
0
Ru
Heart

I for one am glad

That lazy, overpaid, incompentent government employed developers are no more, and instead we have highly skilled commercial ones who must charge less and work harder and produce a better result thanks to the highly competetive nature of the market.

0
0
Anonymous Coward

so first...

Fujitsu take our bonuses off us to pay off the NHS/Government, making working there almost impossible for a lot of us as the bonus was the only reason to put up with the dire pay working for them... then when they have ripped off their own staff and forced some of us into leaving, they try to get the money back from the NHS.

not only that - but they then go on to replace those of us who left *certain* defense contracts with the retards who couldn't make the NHS project run....

head...hurt....NNNNNNNNNNNG

HULK SMASH!

0
0
Coat

Not a protection from FoI

Contrary to the wishes of contractors' legal teams, the term "Commercial in Confidence" is not a cast-iron defence preventing disclosure under FoI. When it turns out that public interest is greater than the potential damage to the parties involved, the result is often disclosure. I look forward to reading the details in Private Eye and El Reg.

But any how....£700m for not delivering at all? That's impressive. Usually you have to look like you are at least trying before scooping that kind of jackpot.

Mine's the one with the Executive Appointments job supplement hanging out of the pocket.

0
0
Joke

This is similar to

all them traders who appear on them "tradesmen from hell" show's on the telly.

I need £200m up front for parts

0
0

Hey, fellah...

...you know we were hired to service and refit your car? And you know how you sacked us because we screwed up the brakes, the transmission and ripped your leather interior? Yeah well... we still want you to pay us for the labour.

I hope the NHS tell them where to go jump - but I doubt they will. They'll probably "settle" and pay them 10% more than they're asking for...

0
0
Silver badge

I want £700 million too!

Why bother with secracy? We already know the government are a best massively incompetent at IT. Most people are far to apathetic to do anything about it because the result would be a different bunch of incompetent officials.

0
0
Stop

hmm

so, assuming Fooj get the £700m, does that mean the people tat got laid off from the NHS contract will get their jobs back, and that everyone will get their annual bonus that got canned when the NHS contract went tits up?

I don't think so somehow...

0
0

It's about time..

..we had the option of voting for a party that promised (is that the word I want?) to have nothing to do with 'consultants' or any other self-proclaimed experts without publishing tender details both before and after the award of any job. As Chris Miller says, this is public money and contract details should be transparent. Those who don't like it need not apply.

0
0

re - Chris Miller

While I'd agree that the like of Fujitsu are not likely to jump off the GT they will say that exposing their Ts&Cs and Commercial Agreements to public scrutiny may give their competitors an unfair advantage and allow them to identify their business process. etc....

However, that argument holds little water as in a competitive world you would expect companies to have slightly different business processes and make edges out of them. This is known and should be discountable and protectable by clever people in the overall scheme.

If it were me, I'd want to be able to place my business with more than 2 or 3 suppliers/contractors to make sure I'm getting competitive value. I'm sure 'buggins turn' plays no part in the competitive process at the moment......

Gov/Major IT whinge at the moment when suggestions are made about cancelling ID Cards database development so they have a licence to lash on more (un-repayable) cost now against the prospect of the contracts being cancelled - all done without scrutiny!!

But, hey, what do I know? I'm only a taxpayer and voter......

0
0
Pirate

JOINT Confidentiality agreement?

Surely Fujitsu have broken this by terminating the contract, haven't they? Since they no longer have to deliver the systems they promised, surely the rest of the Contract is so much vapourware as well... so someone can tell us how much of the project work they actually did, how much it really cost and how much we are being stung for just to keep the Big Boss happy...

And if the NHS has to pay for it, won't Fujitsu have to hand over what (little) they have completed so the NHS can pass it on to whomever gets this pile of cack next?

But no doubt this will go to court in some American state where Fujitsu's lawyers will be able to prove that black is white, the British taxpayer (in the 'person' of the NHS) is in the wrong and their client deserves almost all the money for delivering none of the product...

If EDS and Fujitsu keep pulling out of contracts when they realise they actually need to spend some of their "profit margin" to supply the services offered, I suspect two questions will arise:

1) Why do "we" (the British Government) keep choosing them since they don't seem to like us very much, or give us systems that do what we asked for? and

2) Who is going to actually do the work since the "best choice" obviously can't/won't?

(Oh, and 3, what will happen to all the staff shafted cos the profit ain't as high as the Shareholders were promised?)

F*** U Jack, I'm Through Supporting U.

0
0

Hands off our money

The government should tell them where to get off.

Oh wait, UK politicians are too timid and of course will have received backhanders so that will never happen.

I'm thinking of starting a new party, the no to corporate greed party.

policy number one, haggle for everything and write into contracts clauses so that if contractors make a right royal mess of stuff they get next to nothing.

Bungs and backhanders will be banned and contracts will be available for public inspection.

Sound good?

0
0
Anonymous Coward

Well I hope they get it

and the National Death Service is forced to lay off people in droves.

Darwin award for the NHS perhaps?

0
0
IT Angle

Hands off our money?

But don't you see the opportunities here?

Buy an off the shelf company, tender for the inevitable replacement contract and get it by promising the earth for tuppence then within the year you too could be trousering millions for delivering nothing.

Slightly more seriously I have some sympathy with Fujitsu. Government contracts are essentially impossible, principally because the civil servants who negotiate them generally have no idea what they want then change the terms when they realise that what they bought isn't actually what they need. At least Fujitsu have had the decency to say they don't want to play this game. Other companies in similar situations have milked such situations for contract variation fees many, many times the value of the initial deal.

backhanders are a possibility, but if you go with Occam's "entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessitatem" incompetence is sufficient explanation.

0
0
Anonymous Coward

re: Wokstation

How about we use a metaphor vaguely relevent to what happened?

Something along the lines of "you change the wheels on my car, swap the engine, twiddle some knobs etc but we will only pay you for changing the wheels"

0
0
Coat

I wonder

who will get the consultancy job for analysing why this project went titsup.. In fact... where can I apply to spend 6 months to a year looking important and wise and shocked and then tell them what I knew all along. Typical case of... ah, hangon... I nearly screwed myself out of work there

Mine's the one with all the features added in after the contract was agreed that's being held by the project lead who doesn't have budgetary authority

0
0
Anonymous Coward

quick corrections

re: the government should tell them where to get off -=- why? they are equally guilty of awarding themselves massive golden handshakes based on a failure to produce

re: metaphor vaguely relevant -=- shouldn't that be ... but THIS is a hand grenade; I asked for a Mini (and expected a Mercedes)

0
0

re: quick corrections

So just because one side is guilty of wasting money, we should allow the other side to???

0
0

Shareholders

If they didn't persue all options to get paid then there would be some very difficult questions from their major shareholders.

0
0
Coat

The art of negotiation

The correct government response would be:

1. Here is the bill for the extra cost fixing what you did not deliver.

2. By the way, please do not bother to apply for future jobs from us.

Best wishes,

The Tax Payers

0
0

Deal or No Deal

Speaking from the tax payer’s corner, I hope the NHS can set aside differences in the contract with Fujitsu as it’s a multiple pile up in terms of 700 job losses and the waste of money time and motion of the taxpayer.

I don’t foresee other IT companies doing a better job and I don’t see the point in wasting time handing over other peoples efforts as that would be a big waste and a shame.

Come on NHS & Fujitsu sort this out so we can have better service from the NHS.

0
0
Anonymous Coward

Bonus?

I do hope Fujitsu staff get their bonus if they succeed. GB

0
0
This topic is closed for new posts.

Forums