The Catholic Church’s top astronomer has said there is no contradiction between the one true faith and believing in aliens. The statement will surely spark speculation that the Church knows more than it’s letting on and is preparing the world for some pretty big revelations, or at least laying the groundwork for mass conversions …
What if aliens turn out to be . ....Protestants !
There'll be no talk of "Brother" then.
Lots of info on aliens at the moment
Are we being softened up for an important announcement?
Puts the boot into
the whole genesis thing, dunnit?
Or are catholics now not to take the bible as literal Truth?
The issue is not so much whether alien life exists or not, but the little time bomb ticking away at the base of many religions - the one that says God created Man in His own image...
The consequences of taking *that* line too literally could be immense - there are numerous instances in our terrestrial history of the 'infidels' and the 'subhuman' or 'non-human' being subjected to some jolly rotten behaviour. Mind you, THEY presumably didn't have mind-rays and the technology to cross galaxies in an instant.
That flask of anti-matter in the basement
is actually the communion wine for the first mass to be held post-contact.
The Truth Is Out There
I have long thought that we are being slowly (ever so slowly) being prepared for the truth of the fact that there is alien life out there. And maybe more than a few spieces with varying interests in us.
After all it seems to me pure crap for mankind (Old Skool Vatican) to claim the station he thinks he currently occupies. We are most likely just one drop in a sea of life.
This doesn't mean I believe in the "Great Sky Brothers" or any other such hogwash about aliens coming to save ourselves from ourselves. We originally expected our gods (Ok Told by the church) to do that and now that we see it just isn't so we are now looking towards the stars for the mythical daddy come to save our physical lives from all our self generated woes. When in the end, our fate is our own to make and/or destroy. ET wont save us and neither will the church.
Oh well, must be true then
At least aliens have a testable plausibility about them. On the other hand, how can you take anyone seriously that believes in a concept as vacuous and nonsensical as "god"?
covering all the bases. (With the possible exception in the case raised by Mark T)
No, it's just the slow-news-days, Summer silly season starting early...
Mines the orangey coloured suit with the helmet, gloves and air tanks. And could you open the Pod-bay doors please?
What do you mean "you can't do that"?
The Church has a long history of theological debate on non-human sentient beings.
And I'd rather have them asking the questions than some people I can think of.
An Interesting Forum .... Religion
Amen, Brother ...... and a Funny Thing Happened on the Way to the House of the Rising Sun with its Sisters of Mercy in the Perfumed Garden of Eden ...... an Opening Up of AI NEUKlearer Read42See?!.
‘Vatican star watcher says aliens may be out there’ .... is a pretty safe Bet or is there a Feeling that they are a lot closer and/or already here and tending to Flowers for Power and ITs Immaculately Conceived Controls.
Nothing like hedging your bets is there. Last couple of hundred years, we have proved that if the physical universe is bloody enormous and most likely God, if it exists, lives in a different dimension, so IF aliens exist, then best get on the right side of the argument now.
( Heart icon, even Aliens need love, no matter how many tentacles and/or other apendages they have! )
Alien Labotomy Prize
To whoever guesses correctly what the next announcement will be:
!) Aliens sighted by <country / air force / pilot / insert witness here>
2) Aliens landing on White House lawn.
3) Aliens attempt to land on Number 10 lawn, find it's too small. end up parking on double yellows and getting clamped.
4) Finding out we are actually all Aliens apart from Paris Hilton and that is why we think she is a complete monkey. (no offence intended my primate cousins)
5) Finding out "Independence Day" was in fact, a documentary.
Let the game commence.....
....developed Warp Technology yet?
what if aliens appear, and provide categorical proof that a god does not exist? would that make the vatican disappear in a puff of logic?
"...to the extent of voicing support for intelligent design"
That's not exactly unusual for a pope, shurely? It'd be slightly more surprising if he expressed opinions *against* intelligent design.
I seem to remember similar waffle about aliens from a Church of England spokesman, saying there may be aliens, and Jesus might have visited them in their form and died for their sins etc. If I was still a Christian I'd be pretty skeptical about the concept, that God created humans as unique special friends of his, and didn't happen to mention that he created some other unique special friends... (a bit like having a secret second family, *ahem*)
But I'm not Christian any more, so I have the distinct pleasure of watching church spokespeople squirming in their seats as they try to apply increasingly outdated moral beliefs to changing public attitudes.
Can of worms...
OK. So God could create other beings on other worlds. A few questions come to mind...
Do the aliens have their own Heaven, or do they share ours, or what?
I presume that the aliens can have a soul? Given that they can have 'less' of a soul than a human (i.e. like a monkey, dolphin, dog, horse, cow, ...), can they have 'more' of a soul than humans do? Does God care equally about them as about us, even though the 'soul difference' between an alien and a human could be comparable to the 'soul difference' as between a human and a dog? Does God care about dogs???
Are aliens also made in God's image? Does He (God) even have an image??
Whom do aliens worship, and how? Do they think God has a long flowing beard? What if God didn't send them his Son?
Why is there no mention of any of this (creation of other beings, other heavens, etc...) in the Bible?
Not that I expect the Church to have any answers to these questions, but it seems to me that from the beginning they have been very human-centric will need to overhaul a lot of the dogma...
This isn't a new position, but was held by the venerable C.S. Lewis.
"Or are catholics now not to take the bible as literal Truth?"
The official Catholic line on the Bible: "We should not expect to find in Scripture full scientific accuracy or complete historical precision".
Some Christians believe in a literal interpretation. Catholics don't (or shouldn't). Catholic schools teach evolution, they also teach respect for other people's beliefs (which includes atheist beliefs).
@ Jim Booth
Option 3) made me laugh out loud, in the literal sense. A rare feat, well done!
*goes off in search of batteries for his Thumb*
Well I for one...
...welcome our distant galaxy dwelling overlords / lord?!
We come in marklar!
I just had to say it... and if any marklars are listening:
Marklars, these marklars want to change your marklar. They use Marklar to try and force marklars to believe their marklar. If you let them come to your marklar, they will build marklars and marklars. They will take all your marklars and replace them with their marklar.
"ET spiritus sancti"
Can always rely on the Reg for my morning laugh.
Thank you. I was going to say just the same, but without the eloquence.
>>they also teach respect for other people's beliefs
Which is where is all falls down. If you really and truly believed that there is a god watching you 24/7 and your immortal soul depended on following his law to the letter, how could you possible respect another belief? It is not subjective, like as preference for beer or wine, it is the difference between 100% truth and 100% wrongness/evil/non truth. Unfortunately, the majority who _think_ they believe support the minority nutters who really truly believe, and so religion is maintained.
Jesus meets Zenu
Perhaps the Catholics are preparing to merge with the Scientologists! Think of the money they could both rake in then!
Keep your eyes on Tom Cruise to see if he makes a sudden trip to the Vatican, where he will lobby the pope to make a sweeping damnation of psychiatry and modern pharmaceutical medicine.
The worlds going to shit...
and we seem to becoming more insignificant by the minute. The church better get a grip or we'll all start rioting, creating anarchy and worshiping false prophets. How can we ever cope without the Churches moral guidance and the deep ingrained belief that we are the pinnacle of God's creative wonderment.
I wonder what the alien pope looks like.
I second Gruber's comment on the subhead. Genius.
Screw you guys, home !
Church + Aliens =
I think you know where this is going. Funes pretty much just admitted to the Vatican believing in Lord Xenu. Which, therefore means that Scientology is a secret sub-sect of the Vatican. It's an obvious logical connection.
Mine's the one with "One Religion to rule them all, One Religion to find them, One Religion to bring them all and in the darkness bind them" printed on the back.
What if alien lifeforms are both rational and logical?
The mere concept of a god would be alien to them.
"Are we being softened up for an important announcement?"
No, the start of the Silly Season is never announced, it just creeps up on us by stealth, STEALTH! Or not.
Its in the bible
John 10:16 (King James Version)
And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.
maybe better to start quoting
Ash from the actual movie Alien. no original sin, you see.
Also, technically, the bible having been written quite some time ago, it is logical that it contains no reference to whatever a presumed God may have done in more recent times.
Ah yes. Now this makes sense. The popes are Windows Update.
How can you tell...
How can you tell that E.T. is a Protestant?
Because he looks like one.
(Mine's the green, white and orange one.)
Dolly phone home
<i>And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.</i>
Sheep are aliens? And we're cloning them? WTF?!!!
Mine's the nice cardigan that glows in the dark.
@ It's in the bible
Yes but, does it not also say;
'I sent your luggage off for you,' he said. 'Not much between you, I must say - just one small trunk!'
Five Go Down To The Sea, Ch1 p3 (Hodder & Stoughton Version)
"The Catholic Church’s top astronomer has said there is no contradiction between the one true faith and believing in aliens."
They also say that the bible is self-consistent. He wouldn't know a contradiction if it looked him straight in the eye and bit him in the ass.
It was never the Catholic way to interpret the bible literally, thats a protestant thing. The Church came first, the bible (although believed to be inpired) came as a collection of useful teachings about truth.
You haters would be just as pissed if the church said that there were no aliens.
by the way, there is no more or less proof that God either does or does not exist.
seems like the faithful have a better plan for social harmony than the nonfaithful.
I sugest you go back and read the other posts, and learn somthing, befor you speek again.
"They also say that the bible is self-consistent." Is not somthing the church says. Its somthing you made up. Oh and please don't go for the obvious cheep shots. They just make you look like a fool.
Sort of messes up the idea of humans being the important ones and the rest just being around as support for humans to do what they like with them.
One can respect another viewpoint without believing it is an equal alternative to your own. Besides who says humans had to be perfect to win salvation anyway?
Just because some being is logical and rational doesn't mean it can't speculate on alternative non-material scenarios. Concepts are ten a penny.
> the bible (although believed to be inpired) came as a collection of useful teachings about truth
do these truths include the bit about the earth being created in 6 days? or talking snakes in the garden of eden? or prehistoric man building a supertanker-sized ark for all the animals? or someone getting turned into a pillar of salt? or a virgin giving birth? or the dead being brought back to life? or jesus walking on water? or jesus turning water into wine?
there's about as much truth in the bible as there is in a microsoft press release. got to do something to restore an IT angle......
Arm up lads...
...it's time to take the good word to our heathen alien brothers. Saddle up for the first INTERSTELLAR CRUSADE!
I should go into writing movies :)
Why all this speculation on ET beliefs?
We have a Martian that posts here regularly - just ask him! (good luck understanding the reply though ;)
One question I haven't seen asked is "what if they show up with their own religion?" Better hope they're more tolerant than some of the condescending atheists that post here :p
"Some Christians believe in a literal interpretation. Catholics don't (or shouldn't). Catholic schools teach evolution, they also teach respect for other people's beliefs (which includes atheist beliefs)."
Atheists do not have beliefs. This is a common confusion among religious people unable to think outside their own heads. Atheists merely apply the same standard of evidence to statements like "there is a God" that most people apply to everything, including the religious.
"we could not say that they need redemption"
In which case they would be superior to the human race, and therefore it must be theologically ok for them to take over the Earth, starting by "redeeming" it off humans, by way of "redeeming" humans for their own good. Which is good old Vatican-speak for torture, confession, repentance, and final deliverance (of the soul of course, but only the soul) into the hands of the Creator. Or into the dark womb of Mother Earth, to be more up to date with the narrative. Except for those who have never erred or were infallibible to start with, namely Papa Ratty and his rat-pack. And what is possible is necessary, under some philosophical interpretations of logical modality. So you will die, because you MUST die.
What a creepy lot they are.
You will of course never meet an alien yourself, merely see the bright flashing lights, and feel the endorphine of XTC a few milliseconds before you are vapourised, during which brief time you will remember all the hyperreal cargo-cults about aliens bringing wisdom, and the postmodern scientific conception of "truth" (although not being a Blissett you won't think in those terms, but you will believe that you are finally experiencing the underlying true Platonic reality that the deep and esoteric myths have pointed to all your life - because that's an idea you picked up in Eng.Lit. class without even knowing it) and you will think YES! And that'll be it. Finis. Good-bye and Sayonara.
Sorry folks, death rays do not mean aliens. Neither do announcements by Japanese foreign ministers, Popes, Bliars, or the BBC.
But after 3 days of oohs and ahhs growing steadily less until silence reigns. the silver flying machines will come back down to a base in Montana or somewhere, in a celebratory inversion of the myth just exterminated, and President McCain (for it will be him) will be there, or rather the hollow shell that remains, and as the fliers disembark will slap them on the back and say "Job well done, boys". As they disperse into the Paraguay sunset.
I've noticed that anti religion folk criticising religious beliefs starting from an 11 years olds description of religious philosophy are every bit as amusing as folk of a religious persuasion criticising evolution from an equal platform of ignorance...
> Besides who says humans had to be perfect to win salvation anyway?
A fundamental tenet of Christian belief is that no human is perfect. If they were they wouldn't need salvation...
Another possibly relevant quote from the Bible is often used in science fiction: 'In my father's house there are many mansions".
But this sort of speculation is hundreds of years old in Christian philosophy. If you believe that angels and demons exist as intelligent beings as well as humans its a very easy step to consider other forms of intelligent life.
"Atheists merely apply the same standard of evidence to statements ..."
For a person to do that they must believe in the evidence and either their own or another's ability to correctly deduce a result from that evidence.
I think atheists do have beliefs
They believe that science will, ultimately, be able to explain anything. If science can't do this, then it seems there will always be room for the possible existence of a higher being, which they believe, erm sorry, "know", doesn't exist.
Personally, I'm not sure how you can know (as opposed to "believe") there are no unknown unknowns, but that may just be me.
If one sparrow should fall...
The idea of a Jesuit mission to an alien world is the core story of Mary Doria Russell's book "The Sparrow", I heartily recommend it.
"For a person to do that they must believe in the evidence"
No, they must believe the evidence, not believe IN it. A subtle but important difference.
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