Sensible Article

Nice to see a sensible and balanced article on the subject, it's more than the newspapers and government can manage.

I've not smoked cannabis in years other than in Amsterdam, they have the system right there. (Go sign, for the right to smoke pot)

Police Attitude Unchanged

Still can't see me local plod changing their actual response. They like it when it gives them a convenient excuse to arrest someone so they can see what spills out, but that would be for an associated reason rather than for smoking weed. Remove the weed, warn the pot head, then abscond with weed for later home testing. That will continue to be the state of affairs for possession for the foreseeable future.

The penguin, cos he is clearly suffering from reefer madness. On the desktop? Your having a laugh.

Hear hear !

Well said, spliffs are on me !

Good Article

Good article, well written and a decent logical argument.

Keep up the good work.

@Sensible Article

Amsterdam...? Oh, you mean the place where they've admitted that a comprehensive strategy is needed to ameliorate the social and personal effects of their previously liberal drugs policy?

And Tim:

> That even after you've been found not guilty they still take your money on the basis of an "almost"?

Read your own article... he wasn't found "not guilty", the verdict was "not proven". If you don't understand the meaning of the "third verdict" under Scots Law, you need to bone up on what is undoubtedly a better legal system than the one that exists in England & Wales.

Excellent article

The government are lying to us. They are ignoring even the scientists that are in their pocket. And now they are "announcing plans" - announcing plans! - most dictatorships at least pretend subtlety! - denying us the right to a fair trial, plunging us straight back into the Third World.

All in favour of actually doing something?

Thought not.

Excellent article

This is the kind of measured journalism that is making me turn to El Reg for a balanced view of society rather than the beeb or one of the newspapers. Keep up the good work.

Vulture 'cos it neatly represents where our civil rights seem to be going...

UK.gov

WARNING: May Contain Nuts*

*(but no balls, obviously).

Do what though?

I'm in favour of doing something, but what though?

Apart from voting for the yoghurt weaving greens which I can do with a clear conscience knowing that Labour will be getting stuffed at the next election.

Keep prisons drug free - release all the druggies

If we released from prison all the people convicted of bogus "dealing" charges (these don't need evidence of dealing - if you have sufficient drugs you are resumed to be dealing - apparently the government has never heard of bulk discounf :-) ) there would be space to lock up the occasional terrorist, if we could find any.

ffs

1 - there are quite a few more people in the cuntry than there used to be - so a % increase cannot be done

2 - maybe drs KNOW more about psychosis than before - therefore more readily to diagnose rather than chucking someone in the nut-house

3 - stress levels are wayyyyy up over the last few years - a massive contributer to any mental illnesses

4 - weed DOES give paranoia... but what type of paranoia? mine has only ever been that i might get raided... therefore the LAW creates paranoia rather then the drug itself (fear of being caught)

5 - you hear it in the news all the time.. some youths who have been drinking and smoking cause some trouble. weed is blamed! erm... hello... they also drank alcohol (stella and vodka NEVER EVER seen youths drinking alcopops!!!), which is proven to cause bad behavior - weed itself would just make them sit onthe swings saying 'weeeeee' and giggling

cannabis has been known to affect a certain low percentage of the populus. these people are boarderline schitzophrenic anyway. the same people that will probably be violent on alcohol etc

the problem with classing pot the same class as amphetamines (which i think are still class B) is that people think they offer the same danger. years ago far more people were hurt from speed than e - yet one was B one was A - totally illogical. surely all class B's are the same danger???? </sarcasm>

and surely shouldnt Jacqui Smith now be charged? i mean if i can get done why cant she? they are looking at charging amy winehouse for something she did in the past? surely an MP guilty of a crime deserves to be punished too? surely the same with all the other politicians too?

and i will also let you know that pot ISNT any stronger than pot was 15 years ago. you could still get northen lights and hydro weed back then - NL having well above 20% THC.

also hasnt anybody raised the issue that homegrown is MUCH better for you physically than resin? resin was often re-blocked with vinyl and other shitty plastics (i know, i used to know the people that did it!!! thats why i stopped smoking resin about 10 years ago!)

also sinsemilla is just weed with no seeds, that has not been germinated! thats it! if you get seeds the person growing knows fuck all about what they are doing! (erm... remove the male plants asap!!)

i am seriously worried about a government that can force people to behave the way it wants (i.e drinking lots and paying plenty in taxes, getting so pissed you forget gordon and his cronies are gang raping your arse)

i am also in favour of doing something. but what can we do? protest? thats illegal under our gov :( send the PM and email? (so they can bust me or think of some trumped up charges? or think im brazillian and have an accident?)

i just dont know where to go on this one!

Ban tobacco

Well, they are claiming a bit of blow is a lead in to harder drugs, so smoking B&H is a lead in to smoking mary jane.

The one with the packet of fags and skins in the pocket.

Erm..

I'm living in Amsterdam and let me tell you the streets are just littered, LITTERED with the bodies of people who have been smoking lethal varieties of weed...

Re-classification

So are the government trying to get the message across that amphetamines and barbiturates are no more dangerous than cannabis?

Distinctly nonplussed...

Very disappointed about the government's decision. How can we trust them to make any common sense decisions if they have messed this one up.

I wish they'd just legalise it actually (i'm sure I'm not the only one). With all that fuss about skunk being strong. Skunk is all you can get these days. If it was more like Amsterdam you'd be able to have a choice of weed. I prefer a nice mellow herb or hash, but all I can get currently in the UK is skunk.

Not that I'd vote for Labour anyway, but I have even less respect for them now.

Awsome article

Couldn't agree more, was kinda pissed off and resigned when I heard about this but now i'm ANGRY!

It really makes no sense and is cheap points scoring, what realyl sucks is the Tories are backing them on this.

When will this damn drug war be over!!

@AC (and I'm staying that way too)

"Amsterdam...? Oh, you mean the place where they've admitted that a comprehensive strategy is needed to ameliorate the social and personal effects of their previously liberal drugs policy?"

Oh yeah.. and nothing to do with the Shiny Tory Tits who are in charge here now, since anti-immigrant racism now gets you votes here in Holland.

They hate the fact that this policy has manifestly worked,the only place it has failed is in their heads; so through the inexorable process of spin they are trying to manipulate people around to their view of the 'facts'.

Re: heavy metals

@Aron, Firstly your average garden center compost will contain vastly more heavy metals then even the cheapest hydro nutrient.

When you grow with soil/compost most of the water used evaporates from the soil surface. The reason people grow with hydro is simply that it uses less water for the same yield. Less water = Less money on nutrients = more profit/cheaper own smoke.

The really troublesome growers fill a three bedroom house, lining the floor with plastic sheeting, and dumping *Compost* directly on the floor, then enslave/pay some poor sod to be a human watering can.

Secondly, almost every tomato/cucumber/lettuce/etc that you've bought in the last 10 years from a UK supermarket will have been grown with hydro methods, (organic, my aunt fanny).

There does seem to be some evidence to suggest that heavy metals are widely present in the populations food supply, however no-one has yet suggested that you can ingest them via smoke inhalation.

Hydro is not the problem, the illegality of production is the problem.

A previous poster has it spot on, people self medicate with weed, not to mention it's easier to arrange an appointment with a dealer than a doctor.

As an example, I once accidentally put a 3" nail through the fleshly part of my thumb, I rolled a small strong joint, smoked it, had a vodka shot and pulled the nail out with my teeth, bandaged it and went about my day. Total time from fsckwit to fixed 15mins, A & E waiting time, well you get the point.

Anon as at work.

Tux because you know he likes a toke

Amsterdam spin...

(one of the) Anon Cowards: "Amsterdam...? Oh, you mean the place where they've admitted that a comprehensive strategy is needed to ameliorate the social and personal effects of their previously liberal drugs policy?"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drug_policy_of_the_Netherlands#The_results_of_drug_policy_in_Netherlands

Perhaps your evidence-free assertion has something to do with the localised problems in Amsterdam where a large quantity of the planet congregate in order to smoke a joint in peace? Problems exacerbated by the lure of prostitutes and low level crims who congregate to take advantage of all those stoners? Or maybe the problems in Amsterdam are just a problem relative to the rest of chilled out Holland?

Excellent article which shines a bright light on the political expediency at play here. The science-free, Daily Mail thinking of Smith+Smith and dishonest justifications are all we expect, know and love from the average vote-grubbing politician.

When do we get to vote them out? http://www.libdems.org.uk/news/story.html?id=14286&navPage=news.html

P.S. Can The Reg add a doobie icon to the post selection?

The other side

I do not smoke weed or fags and probably never will, they are just not my cup of tea, but strongly disagree with the government on this one. I think the biggest dangers from weed come from the lack of control in both production and retail. Having no guarantees that it hasn't been cut with something dodgy or that your dealer might decide his 0% finance package suddenly expired would be of far more concern to me.. Legality and therefore control would (in my opinion) greatly reduced the dangers associated with Canabis, making the numbers of those negatively affected by it drop even further below that of alcohol.

Also you hear a lot of talk about the path from soft to hard, from weed to heroin but again I don't see canabis as being the problem... Using the same logic you could ban football - If you play football as a child and have some friends who enjoy it then you might end up going to a game and then the next thing you know you in the middle of a scene from football factory..

I do not know how you get UK.gov to see this side of the argument but I hope one day somebody works it out before it's too late.

Well done Tim for voicing some of the lesser heard points of the great canabis debate!

Addiction

I feel sorry for those who started smoking dope and got addicted to nicotine. But one is highly addictive, can bring on deadly diseases and collects huge amounts of tax while the other doesn't do any of those things and is shat on by HM Gov inc.

It'll drive me to drink - let's see, Tesco are doing bogofs this week on booze.

Shouldn't there be some form of test before people apply to become M.P.'s?

(No, not an IQ test as that's no indication of intelligence) Or is it a case of leaving one's balls outside if you want to 'be someone' in the party.

Bunch of two-faced piss-heads.

Class B

It seems madness to me for the governemt to reclassify canabis to a class B. C'mon Mr Brown GHB is less harmfull than canabis (yet only a class C). Tell that the 19 year old date rape victim.

If it is because of the harm caused then why are cigerattes and alcohol not classified in the same way. Surely they both should be Class A, as both of these drugs are contributers to the deaths of millions every year. How many deaths has cannabis be contributaory factor?

We need to follow Hollands lead on the whole drug situation and have 2 classes, hard drugs and Soft Drugs. Hard being things like Alcohol, cocaine, heroine (the really bad ones) Soft like Mushrooms, canabis etc.

Following their lead will free up thousands and thousands of police hours leaving them free to catch the real criminals like those diving 33mph in a 30mph limit.

Tally-ho all over again.

Standard Gov Behaviour

1. Order report from emminent experts

2. Wait for them to report

3. Check the focus groups/polls

4. Do whatever you want and ingore the report.

Same as for hunting as I recall.

utterly bang on

this article is so spot on i salute you el reg. someone needs to get that stupid little woman out of office - in fact the whole government needs to go as well as all the opposition parties. i love you el reg for saying so succinctly how it really is.

pffft

@ Re: heavy metals

"When you grow with soil/compost most of the water used evaporates from the soil surface. The reason people grow with hydro is simply that it uses less water for the same yield. Less water = Less money on nutrients = more profit/cheaper own smoke."

wrong! hydro uses MAYYY more water actually (ive grown in both) and to be honest i find soil much easier to grow in and only slightly less yielding! plus hydro usually have annoyingly noisy pumps. they also use WAYY more nutes. growing in soil a plant (v big one) needs about 3 litres every 2 days. also you can go away for a few days with soil and plants dont die - if the hydro setup needs water your plants die v quickly as they rely on the hydo keeping the roots moist and oxygenated

also - organic CAN be hydro. its just the nutes you use. there are plenty of nutes that have organic NPK in them.

i can tell you that the weed grown in soil is no worse than hydro - if you know what you are doing. 3 plants do me and the mrs very well :) i also grow different varieties, its always nice to have some very mellow weed as well as some 'skunk' (pfft) such as northern lights thats a bit more mongy. my personal pref is for strains lower in THC - then i can smoke more doobies :)

as mentioned above - if this was all legal you can go and buy/grow mellow strains like FLO (well worth a try :)) as its very mild and more like resin from old (giggly not rooted to the couch). the problem is if you were to grow commercially (and i will point out that i dont sell ANY of mine...) you would go for the Northern Lights and other high yielding strains - not caring about the strength, unfortunately NL and blueberry etc are high in THC

also, the fact i smoke weed means im a nicotine addict :( i have tried smoking pure weed, bongs etc (no tobacco) but the lure of a joint brings you back (smoking lots of pure joints isnt good m'kayyy :). now, if i could grow a 3% strain (easily done if i could setup a lab or something) i could smoke that pure and dump the tobacco :)

I wonder..

Back a few years ago, Larry Flynt threatened to publish all details he had on Congressman's sexual indiscretions if the impeachment of Bill Clinton for his shenanigans with Monica Lewinsky went ahead (I don't know if he followed through on this though)

It would be fun to start a register of all known MP tokers - to join Jacqui "few spliffs" Smith, Boris "tried cocaine but I sneezed, and yes there were a few joints" Johnson (both personal admissions, so nothing actionable there), David "I had a normal student life" Cameron.

As for Gordon Brown - well would you sell anything to a student that looked like this?

http://i161.photobucket.com/albums/t223/ifiwasagecko/Never%20A%20Frown%20With%20Gordon%20Brown/freckly_gordon_brown.jpg

Skull, to represent my solidarity with this governments view on lethal herbs....

Pandering

This is nothing to do with the dangers of the use, if it was then the Government wouldn't be ignoring their advisors. This is purely pandering to readers of the Daily Mail and Daily Express.

Mine's the jacket with a henry in the pocket

El Reg talks Sensi

Mine's the one with the ripped packet of blue Rizla in the pocket.

@not proven

Er, yes: not proven means there wasn't sufficient evidence to prove you did it. It does NOT mean you did it. It means exactly what it says - the crown could not prove its case.

As for why J Smith is doing this - a combination of Puritanism, a distressingly common trait amongst G Brown's supporters, and naked appeal to the Daily Mail brigade. Sad.