see, now this is good biometrics

Their fingerprints will be on file and checked to see if they've already had their allocated methadone this time. If so, they'll not dispense any more.

If they want more, they'll have to find someone else on the fingerprint register. But then the second lot will be going cold turkey, so won't be too keen to help subvert the system.

It doesn't track people, it doesn't require a full medical database lookup (just a common ID string so they can be matched to the main NHS DB if needed), and since anyone on Methadone's going to be a criminal anyway on drugs convictions (I'd assume) it doesn't need any extra additions.

And £3.5m for 100 prisons- even at 1 unit per prison- is pretty good going for a new piece of tech + installation etc

Theres always the risk that it's a pilot scheme for national biometrics databases

Incentive

To put effort into scanning properly.

Not like the Olympic 2012 builders who will just misuse it & complain until it is withdrawn.

</cynical>

@ s. pam

Start Button, Run..., calc, 3500000 / 100 = ?

@ Adam Foxton

most methodone users are in for robbery to be honest mate. as someone who was 'lucky' enough to spend a year in europe's biggest jail (hmp liverpool) i can safely say that the vast majority of 'lags' are in fact smack heads in for theft in some form. maybe thats just the nature of 'thieving scousers' but a fair few in there are from manchester too - but a lot of them were more violent crims

meth @ prison will certainly help them stay calmer :)

>Since anyone on Methadone's going to be a criminal anyway

Why don't we just lock 'em up in closely observed solitary for a couple of weeks, until the shakes wear off? Cold turkey the buggers.

@s. pam

Urm, £35K, not £350K.

Not a bad price, or Idea. About 2-3 times the cost of a despencing assistant for a year, so much cheaper in the long run, and without making mistakes (hopefully).

As for worrying about them being well armoured, no more so that a control drug cabinet which they will have anyway.

What I dont understand is why they are trying to play down biometric ID worrys. That is fine when you are talking about IDing school kids, but these people already have there fingerprints on just about every database going....

Pete must be so happy

In prison and still able to be off his tits.

White mice

Anyone else see the similarity between this and behavioural research? Next they'll be getting the inmates to get through a maze first...

ash

they waited until you went straight

it might work

I'd say the majority of the people in prison are in for burglary or robbery, not drugs offences. That said, the majority of them committed the offence to pay for drugs.

The addicts do need their drugs, it's a vital part of weening them off heroine.

@ Ash

"When did a prison stop being a place of punishment for crime and start being a holiday resort with free drugs?"

When the Daily Mail decided they needed to increase their circulation.

Why are so many people under the impression that the purpose of the justice system is to punish people? The purpose is to protect the public - the punishment aspect is incidental. What possible benefit is there to society in locking someone up for a crime only to have them leave prison in exactly the same circumstances they entered.

The money it costs to get someone off smack is far less than the cost of cleaning up after a smackhead. Would you complain we were wasting money by teaching them to read?

>actually fucking hideous nightmarish shit in prison

But why is that? Isn't it actually like that because of the nut-jobs that are in there?

If it were full of normal people then it'd be alright.

In fact, it'd make quite good cheapo accomodation for people fresh out of uni who just want somewhere to sleep while they pay off their debt to society.

Methadone in prison

A close associate (sounds criminal already) of mine went to prison for two weeks, and went from occasional recreational drug use to a full-blown heroin addiction (administered by the 'screws' in medical grade heroin shots over the first few days whilst suffering from the attendant depression on BEING LOCKED IN A TINY ROOM) to a 180ml a day methadone addiction by the end of the fortnight.

Another close associate was once responsible for running a large prison service, and fought hard to improve and maintain sensible policies for prisoner welfare, including the provision of personal televisions (which SAVES money, since prisoners will fight over whether or not they wanna watch the Eastenders omnibus, requiring more staff and more healthcare), and toilets in cells (ending the wondrous practice of 'mucking out' or whatever the hell it was called (frustration makes me forgetful). People in prison have had their freedom taken away, and will go to tremendous lengths to try to feel 'normal' again. Which will never happen for some or most of them. For those who think that the Shawshank Redemption was overblown in its study of institutionalisation, think again. There are numerous cases of long-term prisoners who cannot adjust to life on the outside and who kill themselves on achieving their long-wished for freedom.

Just because people (perhaps through no fault of their own) are in prison, or on drugs, does not mean they should be tortured by an inadequate and unfeeling system. For example, a great number of those in high security prisons are there for killing their spouses. These people are required to 'take their punishment', despite the fact that they are unlikely to reoffend, and little is done on the outside before their crimes to assist them with their problems (lack of local support networks, family contact etc).

The methadone addict I mentioned was released after their fortnight inside with an astonishing drug addiction and battled by themselves for 20 years to break the addiction themselves, with no assistance from authorities or health practicioners, who believe that drug addicts and criminals have only themselves to blame.

Personally, having dabbled with a wide variety of substances, and lived in deprived areas, I think that most of the addicts and criminals who society loves to put down could be well helped in other ways, through proper and sensible intervention of social services, counselling services, intervention in childhood for family problems, etc etc. A lot of people, in all walks of life, have no one to turn to, ever. That's why people go missing, despite 'loving families', it's why people take to petty crime, it's why people get hooked on drugs. Because noone will talk to them like they are real people, and that is the thing that needs to change. Not the denial of pastoral and medical care (and in some cases what amounts to basic human rights) to those in need, who are more numerous than you care to think.

AC - well, cos, some of this information could be considered inflammatory.

>fight over whether or not they wanna watch the Eastenders omnibus

Of course they'll only fight over that if there's a telly at all.

>Just because people (perhaps through no fault of their own) are in prison, or

> on drugs does not mean they should be tortured by an inadequate and

> unfeeling system.

Who's fault is it then? If it's not theirs then it's obvious they shouldn't be there, but rare exceptions aside, it is their fault and they should be there.

>tortured by an inadequate and unfeeling system

Like by supplying them with dangerous drugs?

Prisons in the UK perform two roles, one is to satisfy the need for revenge amongst the general population, without that, people are likely to get lynched. The other is rehabilitation, which might be better achieved in a different kind of establishment.

But as a society we still want to know that those who hurt us, will get hurt back.

dear jon(b)

And if you don't give them any tv facilities, what does one (better to be impersonal) expect then? A happy world inside where everyone just works all the time, then lock up and sleep? Sure, that'll calm them right down and make everyone chilled and better.

It's true that it's sometimes difficult to see why it's not someone's own fault that they're in prison. But with the exception of what I might call 'the criminally insane', most people just live their lives within the boundaries of what is considered acceptable within their own particular society. And what with the failure of social services and family structures, and the exclusion of some people from 'normal' society from a very young age, this often boils down to whether it can be justified to themselves.

I personally don't believe that imprisonment should be about making the victims feel better, or helping society to believe that their problems are under lock and key. Revenge isn't a great thing, and rarely leads to good, no matter how it is dressed up as 'justice'. Indeed, the desire for 'revenge' is often detrimental to the victims of crimes and their families. Rehabilitation, the acceptance and understanding of people's specific problems and trying to address them in humanitarian ways, is far more important.

It's true that some people (for example, big business frauds, toffs who organise coups) are better locked up, because it might teach them a lesson. Sex offenders (which also encompasses a great number of violent criminals) are also better put inside, because they have the impulse and opportunity to ruin the lives of many people. But even sex offenders might be said to have been failed by society - men unable to attempt normal sexual relationships because of familial abuse or exclusion often turn to sex offence, since they are aware of no other way to channel their desires.

And I agree with you entirely, giving prisoners 'dangerous drugs' is a 'bad thing'. But for the common taxpayer (with whom I am most certainly not in agreement), they would prefer to dole out wholesale cost prescriptions than see prisoners undergo expensive drug rehabilitation programmes, which often require a complete breakdown of the user's social and philosophical framework in order to be effective.

P.S. Many heroin addicts are in well paid jobs, as highly functioning members of society.

Cheap.

Considering it's about £40k a year to keep someone in prison (Note this value might just be another Daily mail shock figure) The machines seem cheap. Shame they're a bloody stupid idea.

Drug screen everyone in prison monthly or weekly, and then you'll know if they're going cold turkey, give them a reduced sentence to snitch on the guard that smuggled the drugs in, problem solved. By the time the reduced sentence ends the ex-prisoner should have gone cold turkey anyway, so he's clean. None of this Methadone rubbish, what good does it do? sustains the period they're addicted for while reducing some suffering. They're in prison for causing suffering, what goes around comes around, if it's really medically bad a doctor can still perscribe it, dishing it out to everyone isn't helping.

@dear jon(b) - Anonymous Cow(ard)

>A happy world inside

Oh sorry, I didn't realise that happiness was the optimum state of a place of punishment. Heaven forfend that there should be sadness in prison.

>'the criminally insane'

Should be in a mental institution rather than prison, but I think I know what you mean by that.

>Revenge isn't a great thing

This is the nub of any argument over prisions - the dual purpose. No revenge isn't nice, but when people are hurt they do want it, and if they don't get it then they stop believing in the judicial system.

>Sex offenders

Interesting view given your opinion on punishment vs rehab, since sex offenders have a low re-offending rate. Of course for them prison is a terrifying experience.

>expensive drug rehabilitation programmes

Lock 'em in solitary until they're off it - probably a couple of weeks, doesn't sound massively expensive. Unless the sentence is long enough for a methadone approach to work then all you're doing is sustaining the addiction until they're out again. It's true that their psychological makeup will mean that most will be back on it, but at least the physical addiction is broken.

>P.S. Many heroin addicts are in well paid jobs, as highly functioning members of society.

I don't see your point... You mean that if they come out of prison with a heroin addiction they could still be "highly functioning" members of society?

That law abiding (and normally very well off) people can sustain an expensive drug habit without ending up in the slammer isn't really a suprise is it? Once they've got a criminal record and no money they would find it hard to function.