"No, I was merely lowering the tone to a level more suiting your pram-like arena."
Really? Do tell.
"The report also found that the US forces went out expecting to be back in time for tea, not for a prolonged combat, and went out with insufficient ammo - this was the reason they were running short of ammo, not because they spent the first hour blazing away on auto."
Hm. So the point I made about the evidence from the Day report destroying your view of Black Hawk Down the movie as some form of evidence is discounted. A report which you now claim to have read. Hm.
"Sorry, I'll stop using long words and stick to those likely to be in your limited vocabulary. But then you started the name-calling. I just stuck to showing how wrong your conclusions were."
He started it. Nunner-nunner. It was like that when I got there, and the big kid did it and ran away.
"I find serving soldiers with real combat experience with the kit in question an invaluable guide."
So the 22 years of steady complaints - from serving soldiers - about the SA80, from 1985 to - at best completion of the A2 upgrade in 2006 - didn't raise any warnings?
"But, seeing as that is obviously outside your arena, why not check a book called "Sniper One" by Dan Mills, which relates the experience of the Princess of Wales's Royal Regiment in Al Amarah in Iraq."
I've read it. Its a fun, uncomplicated read about the military in the middle of a political disaster. Just to remind you, the result was a political and military victory for the other side. In April 2007 British forces pulled out, leaving the opposition in charge of the Maysan Province government. Actually its rather like Black Hawk Down, lots of exciting stuff, and then the Western forces lost.
Incidentally, just in passing, have you noticed how its always the sergeants that write this stuff down. Odd, isn't it? If you're still confused about Mogadishu can I point to Stan Goff's Full Spectrum Disorder. He was the senior Rangers sergeant that confronted the senior officers about their overly regular planning, and was sent home just before Black Hawk Down.
" In this he explicitly states his confidence in the SA80A2 and its accuracy, and he should know as he was the sniper platoon leader."I think his opinion far out-rates yours in both experience or credibility."
We're back to arguing that accuracy is, in some way, relevant for a short ranged weapon. You think it is, I think it isn't. The history of the development of the weapons is with me.
Even so saying its a good - as opposed to accurate - weapon it does depend if he was ordered to write that or not, or whether there was a deal made in order to allow publication under the Official Secrets Act. Its currently impossible to say. We can say that in 2002 the order was given that there was to be no further criticism of the SA80A2 by serving personnel.
On the other hand I have Brigadier Munro, the Director of Infantry who, after the A2 upgrade, said that the entire weapon should be binned, in writing, and ultimately in public.
"I don't have a book to hand that includes details on the SAS use of the C7, but a few simple Googles for SAS and Diemaco should show you are also incorrect there."
I have some books / articles on the subject and I am well aware that they use it. I also know that the C7 is a Canadian made M16 copy, by Colt Canada. Naturally it costs a lot less than the SA80 (£1,000 list price), and is the standard issue weapon for a number of nations, including Denmark and the Netherlands.
"The L42 went to the Gulf as the MoD had dragged its heels over a replacement. The reports from the Gulf showed the aged rifles definitely needed replacing, which kicked the L96 program up a gear, and also that a longer-ranged weapon was also required. There, no mind reading required, just simple facts."
There is, I cheerfully admit, a lag time between ordering something and it turning up - although L96 turned up in quite a short space of time. Your timing problem is that the L96 was specified and ordered before the Gulf War, and it was already well know that the L42 was outdated, otherwise why order it?
Mind you, I'd point out that the SA80 is due for replacement in 2015-20, so there's only 7 years to go of the piece of junk before our troops get something that works. This time I only hope that whatever they get doesn't take, according to optimists, 20 years before its functional.
"Yes, it has been copied as far afield as Cyprus, Indonesia, Kenya, just to name a few. The AK has not been copied - it has been licensed produced or simply mass supplied."
No. Simply wrong. The AK and her variants are produced in at least 20 countries, including India, plus at least a million Ak's are believed to be made without license each year, and even then the license issues was only raised after the fall of Communism, in 1999? 2000? Sometime around then anyway. Prior to that anyone could make them. China has the lead in copying the AK47 as most Vietnam war era AK47s were Chinese Type 56s.
But even if your point is correct, then the SA80 - or a license to manufacture it - has still not been purchased by any other nation.
"HA! I havenm't the time to go through the rest of your errors, but you obviously have a problem separatign facts from your own preferences, possibly due to too much of the General's vodka. Have another bottle or three."
Fair enough, yet you haven't pointed out any errors, merely hand waved them away with an argument that boils down to 'you've spoken to someone who told you something at some time'. For you I tended to stop at 3 or more factual mistakes based on evidence. Sorry, but for all your passion you simply haven't the faintest idea what you are talking about.
Paris: Because she knows passion, and hasn't a clue.