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back to article LiveLeak pulls anti-Koran documentary

Video-sharing website LiveLeak has removed the anti-Koran documentary Fitna by Dutch MP Geert Wilders after receiving threats. "We stood for what we believe in, the ability to be heard, but in the end the price was too high," a statement reads. No details were given, except that the threats were "of a very serious nature". …

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Black Helicopters

Worth pointing out again...

All the film does is show quotes from the koran that islamists use to justify their attacks, and actual film of these same people quoting these quotes, waving swords and talking about killing kufrs. Basically demonstrating that they're a bunch of murderous thugs...

And they respond with death threats. Yeah. That really showed he's wrong. Great job guys!

The funny thing is, at least two high profile terrorists have said that, without opening speil and the scrolling blurb at the end, it's actually the sort of film "they" - the terrorists themselves - would make to propagandise their own people. That being the case, can it be called "anti muslim" if they themselves are making exactly the same films?

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Coat

Sign of the times ...

'... the threats were "of a very serious nature"'.

Kids nowadays! - they just see something in a movie, and copy it.

Mine's the keflar one, please.

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It seems to be back.

They have been brave and put it back up.

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Tim

Fundamentalists of all stripes

Would do well to heed the old Scottish proverb: "There's no fun in twisting the lion's tail if it'll no roar."

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Taken from Liveleak.com

Fitna the Movie: Geert Wilders' film about the Quran (English)

Klik hier voor de Nederlandse versie van 'Fitna the Movie'

** 30/3/2008: Liveleak Update **

On the 28th of March LiveLeak.com was left with no other choice but to remove the film "fitna" from our servers following serious threats to our staff and their families. Since that time we have worked constantly on upgrading all security measures thus offering better protection for our staff and families. With these measures in place we have decided to once more make this video live on our site. We will not be pressured into censoring material which is legal and within our rules. We apologise for the removal and the delay in getting it back, but when you run a website you don't consider that some people would be insecure enough to threaten our lives simply because they do not like the content of a video we neither produced nor endorsed but merely hosted.

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Pirate

Proof

"We'll prove that Islam is a peaceful religion by threatening people and attacking embassies"

[shakes head]

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P2P?

Sounds like a perfect legal use for BitTorrent, etc. to me!

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Joke

wow

islamic funadmentalists sure are sensitive. you'd think a bunch of guys with ak-47's, who look like they have been 'roughing it' for a while, could take a little criticism without blowing up.

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I hope they reported the threats to the police...

... but not to West Midlands Police or they'll end up being investigated themselves.

(If that means nothing to you, google for "undercover mosque".)

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Coat

Threats from who exactly?

Serious threats against their staff and families?

Sounds like someone from the overly-PC UK government contacted them rather than Islamic fundamentalists.

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Silver badge

Geert Wilders may be a D.H.

Geert Wilders may be a D.H., but that doesn't mean that everything he says is false.

The film makes a case: Islam is violent and dangerous and should not be tolerated in a civilised country. However, this can be generalised: *Monotheism* is violent and dangerous and should not be tolerated in a civilised country.

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@Neil Hoskins

Dawgeh, is that you? ;)

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Dead Vulture

I can't help but wonder....

What some views would have been if it had of been something derogatory about Judaism. Unfortuately i think some of the proponents of free speech may have been a little less vocal. If i remember correct there was alot of uproar in the west about Irans conference on the Holocaust, me thinks some people are being a tad hypocritical and i can't stand hyprocisy.

If you look at objectively it is all quite comparable and you realise that the worlds leaders and people of authority have just degenerate into a bunch of name callers and puppet masters who send their sons and daughters to die for their trumpted up causes.

Not much changes then.

Dead vulture because something must be dead because it all stinks

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Anonymous Coward

Does anyone remember...

Any Islamic Fundamentalist movies getting similarly denounced??

You'd think it'd be undesirable for a peaceful religion to be associated with that wouldn't you.

Anon cos... well... free expression is only for minorities these days

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islam, monotheism, ....

@ A J Stiles

That can be further generalised to: Any dogma is potentially dangerous and should not be tolerated in a civilised country.

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Great

They show their displeasure at Islam being depicted as violent and full of nutters, by behaving violently and behaving like nutters, and sending threats.

Oh sweet irony

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Paris Hilton

Moral high ground

As far as I can see if your god is really a big enough sort of guy he's not really gonna give a shit what a few unbelievers think. So if you have to resort to threats to anyone that criticises him/her/it then that sounds like you've got something of an insecurity problem.

So to Liveleak, support to you for not wishing to put you and your families at risk from scumbags, but be happy knowing that you're not the ones in the wrong here.

Paris, 'cos I bet she'd still look good even in a burkha.

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Coat

Hah,

Who'd have thought it? Americans and fundamentalist Islamist have something in common after all...neither have a sense of irony.

Mine's the one of many colours.

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Black Helicopters

@ A J Stiles

Ramen to that!

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Cowards

Is this the same liveleak that has endless suicide bombing videos with celebratory Arabic speeches from the bombers on it? You either show both extremes, or neither. Cowards.

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Stop

@A J Stiles

Unless I am seriously mistaken there are violent and dangerous people that belong to every stripe, monotheistsm, polytheists, atheists. The reasons for people becoming violent and dangerous are many and varied and in my estimation only a few of those reasons can be directly linked to any religion. I think most of those can be tied to poor family life, childhood trauma, etc, but I'm no psychologist so I could be wrong, but I doubt it.

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Happy

Funniest comments about this film

are these:

"Months of hype and concern and general getting excited, and he posts this piece of shite?"

"It was two months late? My son could knock this up in less time than it takes to run the whole film"

"Wilders should take a PC course"

"Wilders stands fully behind this film and isn't going to change anything at... oh... copyright infringement?... damn...... We'll take out two clips and credit that third bloke, but that's it - we're not changing anything"

Oh well, now that everyone's seen it perhaps we'll stop having to hear about it quite so much...

E-

(who doesn't feel any particular need to see the silly thing)

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@ A J Stiles

"Islam is violent and shouldn't be tolerated in civilised society". What does that actually mean? Does mean that we should purge civilised society of all muslims? Or does it mean that we should purge Islam from civilised society. In any case you can't get rid of a belief system unless you kill every believer or you start a process to restrict their practices and over time erode their rights to practice freely. I agree that there are many people who call themselves muslims and have a very distorted view of Islam but that doesn't mean that the doctorine is inhenrently bad. Afterall, Islam's been around for 1400 years and am I right in think that all of a sudden (last 10 years) it's turned ugly?

If one or two bad apples spoil the bunch then does that mean that apple as a fruit is rotten?

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Comparisons to Judaism

The whole movie was just a montage of clips with violent quotes from the Quran, speeches by Imams calling for violence against Westerners, and newspaper clippings.

Now, perhaps I am much mistaken, but last I heard Judaism has not declared a jihad on the West. They havent threatened to terrorist bomb detractors.

I dont even think they threatened those who deny the Holocaust - they just voice their disapproval.

So I dont understand why some are saying that, were this about Judaism, it would be viewed as anti-Semetic. No doubt both religions have some skeletons in their closets, but in the case of Islam, these skeletons seem much more visible. Frankly, I think Islam has far many more skeletons in its closet, because it simply is a more violent religion.

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Anonymous Coward

Internet censorship by Islamic extremists backfires

The film in question can now be found at:

Geert Wilder's Fitna: English Language Version

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=42427935813490087

Alternatively Bitorrent users can download the torrent for the film at;

http://torrents.thepiratebay.org/4102738/Fitna_the_movie_-_English_-_AVI_and_FLV_format.4102738.TPB.torrent

or

http://torrents.thepiratebay.org/4102692/%5BAVI%5D_Fitna_by_Geert_Wilders_-_English.4102692.TPB.torrent

This attempt at Internet censorship by Islamic extremists has backfired

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Coat

All Religions and Dogmas are...

...the creation of man and they will be the downfall of man.

Mine is the white lab coat with truth on the front and science on the back.

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No Difference?

When faced with articles, cartoons, movies, TV shows, societal fads, government policies, etc., that are in opposition to their religions:

Christians write and pray (and yes, sometimes assemble).

Muslims riot and threaten to kill (and often do).

And yet, the multiculturalists want to claim that societies and cultures based on these two faiths should be treated the same...

"Highly illogical, Captain."

(Yes, these statements are generalizations, but the examples are with me.)

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Anonymous Coward

@Philip Kroker

"Unless I am seriously mistaken there are violent and dangerous people that belong to every stripe, monotheistsm, polytheists, atheists."

I don't think you'll find many (any?) etheists who use their etheism to justify violence to non-etheists.

The whole "faith" thing is an ideal tool for the unscrupulous to exercise control over the uneducated.

Theism is a virus that uses many techniques to prevent the infected from becoming uninfected and for infecting or destroying the uninfected. I like to think of religious upbringing as a sort of "root kit" that, in many people, prevents the brain from using its anti-virus bullshit detector.

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Flame

Fools

I completely agree: "Anon cos... well... free expression is only for minorities these days." Seems like the only unprotected group are young white Christian males....

I don't hate Muslims. I hate being subjected to their religion by threat or law. They want to live in my country? Fine, you live by our rules. Don't like western civilization? Go home.

We accept people from all faiths, but not terrorists or nut jobs. We have plenty of that on our own, thank you. You crazies are not welcome. Oh, and if a movie about your terroristic faith offends you, do yourself a favor: don't prove the author's point by acting out his film. The least you could do is ignore it and pretend that its not true. Not saying much for you if you don't have the brains to see this.

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Coat

Do as I say, not as I do

You WILL respect my religion of peace or I WILL kill your infidel ass! Got it? Good.

Mine is the heavy one with the wiring.

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@Jonathan

You kind of proved my point.

I at no time made a comparison of Islam to Judaism what i was comparing was the differing reaction to controversial material by free speech advocates depending on how acceptable they deem the content, I am not counting obscene material here for simplicities sake :), to me it seems like hypocrisy.

But if you want some examples of nastiness for Judaism and with Israel effectively a Jewish state then check out some of the Mossad's exploits; Like their killing spree after those killings at the Olympics camp. Or the old Palestine thing.

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Mo

@Chris Forzetting

(Some) Muslims riot and threaten to kill.

(Some) Christians embark on not-particularly-holy crusades.

The difference is, historically, the Christians were generally successful—I'm guessing that's why you've got such rose-tinted glasses on.

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Joke

Documentary?

Wasn't this 'Fitna the PowerPoint-presentation'?

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But on topic,...

Saying 'Mozart' Wilders is right about the Islam and the Koran, because of the reactions of a childs hand full of extremist demonstrating and shouting (Indonesia: 150 protesters throughing eggs and water bottles on a population of.../Indonesia: convicted extremist moron leader calls for killing/Jordany: minor wants boycots of Dutch products and services/Need I go on?) is at least a little tiny small small bit of cutting corners, don't you think?

Ever wonder why some (extremist) muslims call for a boycot of Dutch products, punishing all Dutch people, who in majority don't support the ridiculous vision of one man? Aren't you doing the same, saying all muslims are bad, because of what a handfull did? Or did your parents forgot to order a brain when you were born?

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Coat

@Matt

Completely agree.

I think there should be a standard immigration test that MUST be passed before you even enter the country.

The test should be,

"Do you swear to place your allegiance to the UK before any allegiance to any deity or religious leader, this includes Mohammed, Allah, Jesus, Jehovah, and the Buddha?"

I should think the correct answer to both of those questions is a bit obvious, even if they are designed to be needlessly informative for the sake of making people swear that the UK is more important than Allah.

There should be a simple rule. If you want to live in the UK, live by UK law. No forced marriages, no honour killings, no segregation and oppression of women - you will integrate with British society, you will take on British values, and you will not unduly criticize the British way of life.

I'm not saying that no one should ever be allowed to criticize the government - I'm saying if they advocate violence against the government or the citizens, they will (if they are immigrants) be charged, and if found guilty, immediately deported and never allowed to even visit the UK again, and placed on a Terror Watch, or (if native) tried and possibly imprisoned for 10-20 years (since it could be classed as treason or conspiracy to incite hatred and violence, I see those as serious crimes).

Oh by 10-20 years I dont mean let out after 6 months for good behaviour. I mean 20 years, if you are shown to have reformed yourself, you may be let out after an absolute minimum of 10, but placed on probation.

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Happy

offended

I am offended by this movie the same way Jews would be offended by a movie glorifying the holocaust or some movie showing paedophilia. You may think these examples are way too extreme but this is how Muslims feel about this movie and the cartoons about the prophet.

I don't agree with those people who are threaten this chap or the cartoon publishers... they the right to publish but we have the right to be protected when people insult us with far-right, neo-con propaganda. If you want to find out about Islam just read the quran and judge for yourselves. PEACE

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Ian

Oi

"Seems like the only unprotected group are young white Christian males...."

You Christian types try to opress us atheist types right to free speech also sometimes you know so don't pretend Christians are some opressed minority!

Just look at the recent hybrid embryo controversy, that's going down the pan purely because the church whined when they don't even understand the facts surrounding it. They've denied me, as an atheist with no objection the right to have access to possible life saving cures that could be discovered through this kind of research. The fair option would've been that Christians boycott such cures due to their objection to the way in which they were discovered but instead they take it to the extreme and prevent those of us who are happy to let the research go ahead having access to such cures when it's their objection and not mine.

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Thumb Down

Off Ended

Nah, just boring really.

But then I don't subscribe to the whole invisible-sky-daddy shtick !

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